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Probably an Unpopular Opinion

Probably an Unpopular Opinion

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Jun 7, 2024, 17:5606/07/24
01/31/20
681

Probably an Unpopular Opinion

In my opinion, nerfing end-game bosses into the dirt and intentionally introducing a champ so broken that he makes Clan Boss irrelevant is really stupid for the health of the game.

Videos are already popping up with new solo strats for what should be challenging end-game content.  Where is the challenge now?  

It looks like Plarium has firmly joined the Ranks of the Particpation Trophy Crowd.  I think I may be done with Raid.

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41
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Comments
Jun 7, 2024, 18:2406/07/24
06/25/20
6496

Were any of those relevant for you? Surely you've already mastered them. Does it matter if newer players are able to do it more easily?

The real problem is lack of anything for *us* to do. If only there were ideas they could use ... 

Jun 7, 2024, 19:0706/07/24
Jun 7, 2024, 19:08(edited)
12/23/19
138

I agree with the poster about the nerf.

I perfer tough bosses that you have to work and kill. (when I played wow on mythical bosses would take 100s of atempts and sometimes weeks to kill 1 boss)

I my opionion the live arena hall was a good way to nerf content over time.

Shogun was nerfed to the ground hes a joke 25 now

Iron Twins if you have geo helicat and scal of drakes 15 was a joke why nerf

Sand devil I dont really see as much of a change as the other 2.


ShortOnSkillzModerator
Jun 7, 2024, 19:1206/07/24
06/24/19
1943

Don't like the nerfs myself but since I was already speed farming them it's of little consequence.  Better for the health of the game for more people to be able to join in on farming them.  Definitely think they over did it though.

Jun 7, 2024, 19:1306/07/24
12/19/19
6209
jrbulldog690

I agree with the poster about the nerf.

I perfer tough bosses that you have to work and kill. (when I played wow on mythical bosses would take 100s of atempts and sometimes weeks to kill 1 boss)

I my opionion the live arena hall was a good way to nerf content over time.

Shogun was nerfed to the ground hes a joke 25 now

Iron Twins if you have geo helicat and scal of drakes 15 was a joke why nerf

Sand devil I dont really see as much of a change as the other 2.


I agree with Kram, we've already beaten it when difficult so who cares if its nerfed for n00bs.  It's a neccessity (along with the constatnt power to creep) to engage any new players (particularly spenders) to keep the game going.

Whether I had to walk thru 12 feet of snow compared to the n00b getting a free snowmobile with the 1st purchase is irrelevant.

dthorne04Moderator
Jun 7, 2024, 19:3506/07/24
12/30/20
5790

Expedites the process for newer players in getting to late game as well as reducing time spent in those areas which opens up more time to participate in the content that requires being active in it like arena, hydra, etc. 

seems a major positive.

Jun 7, 2024, 20:0306/07/24
Jun 7, 2024, 21:12(edited)
01/31/20
681
kramaswamy.kr

Were any of those relevant for you? Surely you've already mastered them. Does it matter if newer players are able to do it more easily?

The real problem is lack of anything for *us* to do. If only there were ideas they could use ... 

Yes, I have basically finished the game.  The only  challenges left for me are:

  1. Getting to G4 in Live Arena
  2. Continuing to push my Hydra Damage (which is a love/hate relationship due to the required time commitment that Plarium refuses to address)
  3. Soulcross.  Even with a 24M Power Account and a pretty deep roster, the restrictions on many stages are so tight that it will be years before I can complete all of it.

I object to the very principle of these boss nerfs.  They were designed to be tough challenges, and  now they simply aren't.  Obviously time will tell, and if more people play the game and enjoy the game (and spend more money), then it will prove out as the correct decision.  Personally, I think it is a bad decision, and it is one more example of Plarium "fixing" things that aren't broken and ignoring things that are insanely broken.  

Maybe I was just looking for a reason to quit, and maybe I found one.  I didn't do a "Priest Guardian" yet, so only time will tell.        

Jun 7, 2024, 20:3206/07/24
01/31/20
681
Trips

I agree with Kram, we've already beaten it when difficult so who cares if its nerfed for n00bs.  It's a neccessity (along with the constatnt power to creep) to engage any new players (particularly spenders) to keep the game going.

Whether I had to walk thru 12 feet of snow compared to the n00b getting a free snowmobile with the 1st purchase is irrelevant.

Very Interesting. 

I propose enhancements to certain game modes that would potentially require significant effort to complete and offer correspondingly improved rewards, and you say I am "asking for free stuff" when I am really asking for new challenges to complete.  

Now, Palrium introduces wide-reaching changes that are essentially heaping rewards onto players that could not have earned those same rewards last week, and you say "seems like a good idea to me."

Jun 7, 2024, 21:1406/07/24
12/19/19
6209
WileyMan

Very Interesting. 

I propose enhancements to certain game modes that would potentially require significant effort to complete and offer correspondingly improved rewards, and you say I am "asking for free stuff" when I am really asking for new challenges to complete.  

Now, Palrium introduces wide-reaching changes that are essentially heaping rewards onto players that could not have earned those same rewards last week, and you say "seems like a good idea to me."

I'm saying it doesn't impact me directly.  I am no more concerned with what someone playing 4 years less than me is able to get in rewards than the whales thar get everything... but indirectly those 2 groups are the only reason the longterm f2p (me) is still playing.  Because the game would not exist otherwise. 

I'm not against your suggestions entirely, but none will ever be released with the generous rewards you suggest 😀. Think of the incremental from normal to hard dungeons, relative to your grandiose proposals lol.

Jun 8, 2024, 02:5106/08/24
12/18/19
321

I couldnt do bosses with proper champs, i pulled out my 2 painkeepers and emic or my aniri and whatnot and made a comedy out of the situations

Better them being nerfed and actually playable than the shitshow they were before

The problem with these bosses is that the mechanics are playable only with very small number of champs and cheese is kinda the only option for majority of players

also the endgame argument is shit, its thrown around for everything, this is endgame that is endgame, the thing next to that is endgame, did i mention that too is endgame, endgame endgame endgame *pukes a little in my mouth*

ShortOnSkillzModerator
Jun 8, 2024, 13:2506/08/24
06/24/19
1943
WileyMan

Yes, I have basically finished the game.  The only  challenges left for me are:

  1. Getting to G4 in Live Arena
  2. Continuing to push my Hydra Damage (which is a love/hate relationship due to the required time commitment that Plarium refuses to address)
  3. Soulcross.  Even with a 24M Power Account and a pretty deep roster, the restrictions on many stages are so tight that it will be years before I can complete all of it.

I object to the very principle of these boss nerfs.  They were designed to be tough challenges, and  now they simply aren't.  Obviously time will tell, and if more people play the game and enjoy the game (and spend more money), then it will prove out as the correct decision.  Personally, I think it is a bad decision, and it is one more example of Plarium "fixing" things that aren't broken and ignoring things that are insanely broken.  

Maybe I was just looking for a reason to quit, and maybe I found one.  I didn't do a "Priest Guardian" yet, so only time will tell.        

Regarding Soulcross, is it you're unable or just can't be bothered?  I'm kind of in the later camp I think.  I'm sure if I wanted to commit the time and resources I could do it but just can't be bothered.

Jun 8, 2024, 14:5206/08/24
01/31/20
681
ShortOnSkillz

Regarding Soulcross, is it you're unable or just can't be bothered?  I'm kind of in the later camp I think.  I'm sure if I wanted to commit the time and resources I could do it but just can't be bothered.

Some of Both.

I am hard-locked at S6 on 2-3 rotations due to having almost no built toons available, and am unwilling to build the garbage that I do have.  

Same goes for Sand Devil @ S9.

And, really, anything beyond there is 50/50 the same story.

Perfect Example is S12 this time:  I have Padraig & Steelskull at L60.  Padraig is an awesome build but Steelskull is a very old FW build that hasn't been used or touched in years.  I have no one else worth investing resources in. 

Jun 8, 2024, 18:5406/08/24
12/07/20
89
WileyMan

Some of Both.

I am hard-locked at S6 on 2-3 rotations due to having almost no built toons available, and am unwilling to build the garbage that I do have.  

Same goes for Sand Devil @ S9.

And, really, anything beyond there is 50/50 the same story.

Perfect Example is S12 this time:  I have Padraig & Steelskull at L60.  Padraig is an awesome build but Steelskull is a very old FW build that hasn't been used or touched in years.  I have no one else worth investing resources in. 

This is the problem with soulcross, they want us to level and build rubbish epics which no one wud even consider doing if it wasnt for soulcross 

the direct comparrison to soulcross is DT secret rooms, the difference being u were still doing Lydia at the time so building epics and fleshing out rosters was essential

Soulcross is meant to be endgame content so why on earth does it require 2nd rate epics instead of endgame viable legos

Jun 8, 2024, 19:2106/08/24
12/19/19
6209

@ShortOnSkillz 

@WileyMan 

@dax (cant tag you lol)

This is my reply to each of your last posts:    

GIT GUD 😁

Complaining that the admittedly most end-game content is too difficult to complete with already built toons... come on guys.... 

1) Yes, you will have to build epics you would not otherwise.  Not sure how building more champs is a surprise

2) Swap best gear (pvp sets, stun sets) -- I'm not willing to do this but thats a me problem

3) Slowly build for a few stages each month and gradually get there.

1 is a given, I'm skipping 2 and just doing 3.  I guess if I was down to 1 or 2 (I'm around 90 each rotation now) I'd redconsider.

I'm certain all 3 of you have better gear than I, probably getting further already

 

Jun 8, 2024, 20:4206/08/24
12/19/19
6209
sharkium

I couldnt do bosses with proper champs, i pulled out my 2 painkeepers and emic or my aniri and whatnot and made a comedy out of the situations

Better them being nerfed and actually playable than the shitshow they were before

The problem with these bosses is that the mechanics are playable only with very small number of champs and cheese is kinda the only option for majority of players

also the endgame argument is shit, its thrown around for everything, this is endgame that is endgame, the thing next to that is endgame, did i mention that too is endgame, endgame endgame endgame *pukes a little in my mouth*

@WileyMan 

Ok. I change my vote.  No more participation trophies!  

Jun 9, 2024, 02:2406/09/24
12/18/19
321
Trips

@WileyMan 

Ok. I change my vote.  No more participation trophies!  

Participation trophies are not needed, balance would be good tho, just look at this shit man, when i search for sand devil 25 teams that i can build

i

and now when i click exclude aniri and blizaar

i

only 1 team i can build

-------------------------

Lets look at the iron twins

i

now i exclude emic and geo

i


When luck hasnt been on someones side and they dont have say maneater and demytha too then iron twins is simply a pipedream for them, git gud is valid until i certain point only, i do love my souls games so they are always a good example, in there i can go in to boss fight with no armor, lvl 1 weapon and through practice i will beat it, you cant really do that in here, in raid its more like you either have the champs or you dont

Jun 9, 2024, 05:0506/09/24
Jun 9, 2024, 21:09(edited)
01/31/20
681
sharkium

Participation trophies are not needed, balance would be good tho, just look at this shit man, when i search for sand devil 25 teams that i can build

i

and now when i click exclude aniri and blizaar

i

only 1 team i can build

-------------------------

Lets look at the iron twins

i

now i exclude emic and geo

i


When luck hasnt been on someones side and they dont have say maneater and demytha too then iron twins is simply a pipedream for them, git gud is valid until i certain point only, i do love my souls games so they are always a good example, in there i can go in to boss fight with no armor, lvl 1 weapon and through practice i will beat it, you cant really do that in here, in raid its more like you either have the champs or you dont

This assumes you need to use a tool like the HH Team Optimizer in the first place and that your imagination is limited by the teams that other people have used with toons you happen to have.  

I beat IT 15, SD 25 & PS 25 with my own team comps that were built and setup w/o using HH Team Optimizer to come up with them, or to tune them.  

It took a lot longer than if I had used the HH Team Optimizer or used a cheese comp off of YouTube, but that is how I like to play the game.

You can do it.  

Jun 9, 2024, 05:1506/09/24
01/31/20
681
Trips

@ShortOnSkillz 

@WileyMan 

@dax (cant tag you lol)

This is my reply to each of your last posts:    

GIT GUD 😁

Complaining that the admittedly most end-game content is too difficult to complete with already built toons... come on guys.... 

1) Yes, you will have to build epics you would not otherwise.  Not sure how building more champs is a surprise

2) Swap best gear (pvp sets, stun sets) -- I'm not willing to do this but thats a me problem

3) Slowly build for a few stages each month and gradually get there.

1 is a given, I'm skipping 2 and just doing 3.  I guess if I was down to 1 or 2 (I'm around 90 each rotation now) I'd redconsider.

I'm certain all 3 of you have better gear than I, probably getting further already

 

I wasn't actually complaining.  I was merely answering a question asked by @ShortOnSkillz 

I am perfectly content to not be able to pass certain parts of SoulCross for years (or never), and I am not building garbage just to get a few medicore goodies.

This time around, I built & booked Chaguur just to get past Sand Devil in SoulCross.  He's a pretty fun toon, but I have no real need for him anywhere outside of SoulCross.  In fact, I briefly considered using him to +1 my Ramantu when I pulled him a few months ago.    

I didn't even want to burn resources on a Void Lego that I don't need, let alone a bunch of C-Tier Epics....They can keep the 500 mortal essences and the 27 gems....😜  

Jun 9, 2024, 05:1806/09/24
01/31/20
681
sharkium

I couldnt do bosses with proper champs, i pulled out my 2 painkeepers and emic or my aniri and whatnot and made a comedy out of the situations

Better them being nerfed and actually playable than the shitshow they were before

The problem with these bosses is that the mechanics are playable only with very small number of champs and cheese is kinda the only option for majority of players

also the endgame argument is shit, its thrown around for everything, this is endgame that is endgame, the thing next to that is endgame, did i mention that too is endgame, endgame endgame endgame *pukes a little in my mouth*

Be glad I am not in charge.  I would've nerfed the Aniri duos for SD into the dirt when they were first discovered.

They (inexplicably) nerfed unkillable strats for Iron Twins, but left Block Damage alone.  Makes no sense.  If you are gonna do one, you should do both.

Jun 9, 2024, 06:0206/09/24
12/18/19
321
WileyMan

Be glad I am not in charge.  I would've nerfed the Aniri duos for SD into the dirt when they were first discovered.

They (inexplicably) nerfed unkillable strats for Iron Twins, but left Block Damage alone.  Makes no sense.  If you are gonna do one, you should do both.

And youre right they should be nerfed, but thats the stick, lets get to the carrot....the bosses should be beatable with reasonable difficulty using wide range of champs from your roster, requiring a player to play for 2 or 3 years and even then hanging it on a thread of shard pull rng is a bit stupid, or am i not understanding how fun works

Jun 9, 2024, 19:5006/09/24
12/19/19
6209
WileyMan

I wasn't actually complaining.  I was merely answering a question asked by @ShortOnSkillz 

I am perfectly content to not be able to pass certain parts of SoulCross for years (or never), and I am not building garbage just to get a few medicore goodies.

This time around, I built & booked Chaguur just to get past Sand Devil in SoulCross.  He's a pretty fun toon, but I have no real need for him anywhere outside of SoulCross.  In fact, I briefly considered using him to +1 my Ramantu when I pulled him a few months ago.    

I didn't even want to burn resources on a Void Lego that I don't need, let alone a bunch of C-Tier Epics....They can keep the 500 mortal essences and the 27 gems....😜  

I think you are undervaluing the soulcross rewards. I know the ones I am getting are crazy good "free rewards " in both normal and hard. Building a couple epics each training event seems like a necessity, otherwise I would just increase the amount of chickens I will never use. And I chip away at my gear storage problem lol.  


i

I think I could have gotten 1 or 2 more, but didn't realize the reset was happening.  I'd say 6 to 12 months knocking 1 or 2 out each rotation is reasonable. 

I definitely think choosing to progress in Sinatros is smarter than resource dumping to get Marius a little bit sooner.